Official Transcript of Proceedings NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION Title: Advisory Committee on Reactor Safeguards Meeting of the Fukushima Subcommittee Docket Number: (n/a) Location: Rockville, Maryland Date: Tuesday, July 8, 2014 Work Order No.: NRC-898 Pages 1-293 NEAL R. GROSS AND CO., INC. Court Reporters and Transcribers 1323 Rhode Island Avenue, N.W. Washington, D.C. 20005 (202) 234-4433 1 1 UNITED STATES OF AMERICA 2 NUCLEAR REGULATORY COMMISSION 3 + + + + + 4 ADVISORY COMMITTEE ON REACTOR SAFEGUARDS 5 (ACRS) 6 + + + + + 7 FUKUSHIMA SUBCOMMITTEE 8 + + + + + 9 TUESDAY 10 JULY 8, 2014 11 + + + + + 12 ROCKVILLE, MARYLAND 13 + + + + + 14 The Subcommittee met at the Nuclear 15 Regulatory Commission, Two White Flint North, Room 16 T2B1, 11545 Rockville Pike, at 1:30 p.m., Joy Rempe, 17 Chairman, presiding. 18 COMMITTEE MEMBERS: 19 JOY REMPE, Chairman 20 DENNIS C. BLEY, Member-at-Large 21 SANJOY BANERJEE, Member 22 CHARLES H. BROWN, JR. Member 23 MICHAEL L. CORRADINI, Member 24 DANA A. POWERS, Member 25 HAROLD B. RAY, Member NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W. (202) 234-4433 WASHINGTON, D.C. 20005-3701 (202) 234-4433 2 1 MICHAEL T. RYAN, Member 2 STEPHEN P. SCHULTZ, Member 3 GORDON R. SKILLMAN, Member 4 JOHN W. STETKAR, Member 5 DESIGNATED FEDERAL OFFICIAL: 6 WEIDONG WANG 7 8 ALSO PRESENT: 9 DON ALGAMA, NRC 10 SUD BASU, NRC 11 HOSSEIN ESMAILI, NRC 12 RICHARD LEE, NRC 13 ALLEN NOTAFRANCESCO, NRC 14 STU RICHARDS, NRC 15 MIKE SALAY, NRC 16 17 *Present via telephone 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W. (202) 234-4433 WASHINGTON, D.C. 20005-3701 (202) 234-4433 3 1 T-A-B-L-E O-F C-O-N-T-E-N-T-S 2 ACRS Opening Remarks 3 Joy Rempe ........................................4 4 Staff Opening Remarks 5 Stu Richards .....................................6 6 Overview of Severe Accident Research 7 Richard Lee ......................................7 8 Molten Core-Concrete Interaction and Fuel-Coolant 9 Interactions (CSNI MCCI SOAR, NRC-IRSN-EdF testing) 10 Sud Basu ....................................... 25 11 Hydrogen (CSNI CAPS on hydrogen and ERCOSAM) 12 Don Algama ..................................... 65 13 Allen Notafrancesco ............................ 67 14 Fission Products Behavior (Phebus - ISTP CSNI-STEM, 15 CSNI-BIP2, SARNET2) 16 Mike Salay ..................................... 80 17 MELCOR Code: Status and Applications 18 Hossein Esmaili ............................... 110 19 Fukushima-Related Activities 20 Richard Lee ................................... 127 21 What Next 22 Richard Lee ................................... 132 23 Sud Basu ...................................... 147 24 Committee Comments ............................. 163 25 Adjourn ........................................ 178 NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W. (202) 234-4433 WASHINGTON, D.C. 20005-3701 (202) 234-4433 4 1 P-R-O-C-E-E-D-I-N-G-S 2 8:30 p.m. 3 CHAIR REMPE: This meeting will now come 4 to order. This is a meeting of the Fukushima 5 Subcommittee, a standing subcommittee of the Advisory 6 Committee on Reactor Safeguards, and I'm Joy Rempe, the 7 chairman of this meeting of the Fukushima Subcommittee. 8 ACRS members in attendance are Sanjoy 9 Banerjee, Stephen Schultz, Harold Ray, Dana Powers, 10 Gordon Skillman, Ron Ballinger, Charlie Brown and Mike 11 Corradini. Weidong Wang of the ACRS staff is the 12 designated federal official for this meeting. 13 In this meeting the Subcommittee will 14 review severe accident research activities conducted 15 by NRC's Office of Research, and we'll hear 16 presentations from the NRC staff. We've received no 17 written comments or requests to make oral statements 18 from members of the public regarding today's meeting, 19 and the enter meeting will be open to public attendance. 20 The Subcommittee will gather information, 21 analyze relevant issues and facts and formulate 22 proposed decisions and actions as appropriate for 23 deliberation by the Full Committee. 24 The rules for participation in today's 25 meeting have been announced as part of the notice of NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W. (202) 234-4433 WASHINGTON, D.C. 20005-3701 (202) 234-4433 5 Federal 1 this meeting previously published in the Register 2 , and a transcript of the meeting is being kept Federal 3 and will be made available as stated in the Register 4 notice. Therefore, we request that 5 participants in this meeting use the microphones 6 located throughout the meeting when addressing the 7 Subcommittee. The participants should first identify 8 themselves and speak with sufficient clarity and volume 9 so they may be readily heard. 10 And before I begin this meeting, I'd first 11 like to acknowledge that we have two members who showed 12 up late: Dennis Bley and John Stetkar. 13 And I'd also like to mention a couple of 14 facts about some background on this meeting with 15 respect to why we're having it. 16 In completing our biannual research 17 review, Dr. Lee and his colleagues provided me a lot 18 of interesting information such as new data from 19 international experimental programs, descriptions of 20 updates that they've completed on new models for and 21 analyses completed with their severe accident analysis 22 code, MELCOR, and ongoing efforts to update the 23 alternate source term. And although I've provided a 24 summary of this information in our report, I suggested 25 that Richard and his staff come provide our NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W. (202) 234-4433 WASHINGTON, D.C. 20005-3701 (202) 234-4433 6 1 Subcommittee some additional details. And in 2 particular I've asked them to not only describe this 3 new information, but also ask them to emphasize the 4 impact of their new research results. And they've 5 graciously agreed to provide this information to us, 6 and I'd like to thank them in advance for their efforts. 7 So, Richard? 8 MR. LEE: Thank you. Instead of me giving 9 open remarks, Stu Richards, our deputy division 10 director from DSA will give the remarks. So, Stu? 11 MR. RICHARDS: I just want to say thank you 12 for inviting us to be here today. We appreciate that 13 and we do really appreciate the feedback that we get 14 from the ACRS. 15 I just want to acknowledge a couple, three 16 months ago Dr. Powers, and I think helped by Dr. 17 Corradini, came up to Church Street and addressed our 18 division with some insights about the ACRS. So today's 19 a little bit of a test for us to see if we picked up 20 on any of the tips that he provided, so if we will do 21 well on that. 22 Were you at that session, Sud? You look 23 surprised. 24 (Laughter) 25 DR. BASU: Yes. NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W. (202) 234-4433 WASHINGTON, D.C. 20005-3701 (202) 234-4433 7 1 PARTICIPANT: Just don't listen to Dr. 2 Powers and Dr. Corradini. 3 DR. BASU: Yes, I was there as a matter of 4 fact. 5 MR. RICHARDS: But at any rate, this area 6 is very important to the Office of Research. We have 7 a lot of important work going on. 8 A lot on the agenda today and we do 9 appreciate the time you take to listen to what we have 10 to say and provide us some feedback. So thank you. 11 MR. LEE: Okay. Getting onto the severe 12 accident research, this is a view graph that we show 13 how the experiment is being used to validate the Code 14 and how it is used in our regulatory analysis to support 15 the agency various activities. On this side here are 16 the experiments. Some of them has been completed. 17 The ARTIST facility is being completed in Switzerland. 18 And these are the major output from the program. I just 19 highlight the output there, probably more than other 20 secondary results that come out from this program. But 21 this is the major thrust of the experimental program. 22 For example, the Phebus fission products, 23 that has been completed. The International Source 24 Term Program is still going on. There are some tests 25 that was ran that analysis of those are still going on. NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W. (202) 234-4433 WASHINGTON, D.C. 20005-3701 (202) 234-4433 8 1 In terms of the Phebus, the fission products one is an 2 integral test. This program that follow onto the 3 fission product is a separate effect test and compose 4 of many, many parts that investigate different thing; 5 for example, control rod behavior and the major focus 6 is really on iodine chemistry. 7 The OECD-MCCI2 has also been completed and 8 there are some follow-on tests that we follow on with 9 the EdF, IRSN and us. We conducting two additional 10 tests since that program ended at Argonne National Lab. 11 That collaboration is still ongoing, but of course 12 those are focus on MCCI, which you will hear at the next 13 presentation. The OECD behavior of Iodine Project is 14 -- the major lab is doing it at the AECL, the Atomic 15 Energy of Canada Limited in Canada, and it is focused 16 on iodine chemistry. 17 There is also another program called the 18 OECD-STEM Project, which is also a OECD Project. It's 19 not listed here. And it's also focus on chemistry, but 20 it's complementary to the OECD BIP and STEM. Of course 21 we have the Cooperative Severe Accident Research 22 Program with NRC that has been in existence since after 23 the TMI when a lot of research, severe accident research 24 was launch in U.S. That program continue on. In early 25 '80s it was of course focus on experiment. Now it's NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W. (202) 234-4433 WASHINGTON, D.C. 20005-3701 (202) 234-4433 9 1 focus on the MELCOR Code as the principal exchange from 2 the U.S. that we collaborate with other countries. And 3 in turn we getting all sort of experiment from other 4 partners. For example, the test that perform at 5 France for where high burnup fuel. We got it because 6 of the Cooperative Research Program. The quench data 7 on severe fuel damage that we get from Germany, which 8 we continue to get every year. And those are -- we got 9 those information without paying for anything. 10 And then of course we have the Zirc Fire 11 that has been completed at the U.S. OECD that we use 12 to validate the MELCOR model for the spent fuel pool. 13 The BWR was the first one conducted many years ago. The 14 PWR was just completed. 15 The SERENA Program, which is the 16 fuel-coolant interactions, that one has been 17 completed. Those are two program focus on that Sud 18 going to talk to you more about it. And one is in France 19 and the other one is in Korea. Those project probably 20 will spin off additional research, going to be come in 21 the future. We will talk about little bit more about 22 at the end of this today. 23 The codes are the MELCOR Codes and the 24 Texas Code, which is FCR Codes, because we do not 25 incorporate the fuel cooling reactions calculations in NEAL R. GROSS COURT REPORTERS AND TRANSCRIBERS 1323 RHODE ISLAND AVE., N.W. (202) 234-4433 WASHINGTON, D.C. 20005-3701 (202) 234-4433