. "5^ \ S. HRG. 104-74 Pt. 3 Enforcement Mechanisms for the Balanced Budget Amendment Y 4. EC 7:B 85/13/995/PT. 3 Enforcenent Hechanisns for the Bala. . tiHARINGS ^pas ^2i f^ BEFORETHE JOINT ECONOMIC COMMITTEE CONGRESS OF THE UNITED STATES ONE HUNDRED FOURTH CONGRESS FIRST SESSION Part 3 February 16, 1995 Printed for the use ofthe Joint Economic Committee U.S. GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFRCE 93-804 cc WASIDNGTON: 1995 ForsalebytheU.S.GovernmentPrintingOffice SuperintendentofDocuments,CongressionalSalesOffice,Washington,DC 20402 ISBN 0-16-0476A8-8 . -N^ S. HRG. 104—74 Pt. 3 Enforcement Mechanisms for the Balanced Budget Amendment Y4.EC 7:B 85/13/995/PT.3 Enforcenent flechanisns for the Bala. . m!.ARINGS ^p^s £<2^ ^ BEFORETHE JOINT ECONOMIC COMMITTEE ! CONGRESS OF THE UNITED STATES ONE HUNDRED FOURTH CONGRESS FIRST SESSION Part 3 February 16, 1995 Printed for the use ofthe Joint Economic Committee U.S. GOVERNMENTPRIN'ONC. OFHCE 93-804 cc WASFDNGTON: 1995 ForsalebytheU.S.GovernmentPrintingOffice SuperintendentofDocuments,CongressionalSalesOffice,Washington,DC 20402 ISBN 0-16-047648-8 JOINT ECONOMIC COMMITTEE (Crealcd pursumU to Sec. 5(a) ofPublic Law 304, 79th Congress] SICNATIi HOUSE OF REPRESENlATIVEvS CONNIE MACK, Florida. JIM SAXTON. New Jersey, Chiiinnan Vice Clxainnan WILLIAM V. ROTH, JR., Delaware THOMAS W. EWING. Illinois LARRY E. CRAIG, Idaho JACK QUINN. New York ROBERT F. BENNETT, Utah DONALD A. MANZULLO, Illinois RICK SANTORUM, Pennsylvania MARK SANFORD, South Carolina ROD GRAMS, Minnesota MAC THORNBERRY, Texas JEFF BINGAMAN, New Mexico FORTNEY PETESTARK, California PAUL S. SARBANES. Maryland DAVID R. OBEY, Wisconsin EDWARD M. KENNEDY, Massachusetts LEE H. HAMILTON. Indiana CHARLES S. ROBB, Virginia KWEISI MFUME. Maryland ROBERT N. MOTTICE. Executive Direcior LEE PRICE. MinorityStaffDirector Prepared by: JUANITA Y. MORGAN and COLLEEN J. HEALY (ii) Contents Opening StatementsofMembers SenatorConnieMack,Chairman 1 RepresentativeJim Saxton, ViceChairman 3 RepresentativeJackQuinn 4 SenatorRodGrams 15 SenatorRobert Bennett 26 RepresentativeThomasW. liwing 27 Witnesses PanelI StatementofTheHonorableJon Kyi.SenatorfromArizona 4 StatementofThe HonorableDan Miller.Representative from Florida 8 StatementofTheHonorableDavidMinge.Representativefrom Minnesota 14 StatementofThe 1lonorablePhilGramm.Senatorfrom Texas 17 PanelII StatementofGroverG. Norquist,President.AmericansforTaxReform 28 StatementofJoeCobb.John M. Olin Fellowin Economics,TheHeritage Foundation 29 StatementofMarioLewis,Jr.,ExecutiveDirector,TheCompetitiveEnterprise Institute 34 StatementofThomasA. Schatz.President,CitizensAgainstGovernmentWaste .... 37 StatementofMartinA. Regalia.VicePresident,EconomicPolicyandChief Economist,U.S. ChamberofCommerce 41 Submissions forthe Record Prepared StatementofSenatorConnie Mack 58 PreparedStatementofRepresentativeJackQuinn 60 Prepared StatementofSenatorJon Kyi 61 Prepared StatementofRepresentativeDan Miller 65 PreparedStatementofRepresentativeDavid Minge 75 PreparedStatementofGroverG.Norquist 78 PreparedStatementofJoeCobb 80 Prepared StatementofMarioLewis,Jr 102 PreparedStatementofThomasA. Schatz 107 PreparedStatementofMartinA. Regalia 114 (Hi) Enforcement Mechanisms for the Balanced Budget Amendment Thursday, February 16, 1995 CongressoftheUnitedStates, JointEconomicCommittee, Washington,D.C. The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 9:30 a.m., Dirksen Senate Office Building, Room 562, Honorable Connie Mack, Chairman ofthe Committee, presiding. Present: Senators Mack, Bennett and Grams, and Representatives Saxton, Ewing and Quinn. Also Present: Robert Mottice, Allison Tyrer, Colleen Healy, Juanita Morgan, Christopher Frenze, Brian Wesbury, Greg Williams and Missy Shorey. Opening Statement of Senator Connie Mack, Chairman Senator Mack. The meeting will come to order. I suspect that some ofour othermembers from the first panel will be here shortly. Representative Saxton. We are having a series of— well, not a series ofvotes, but we will be having a vote to follow the one that wejust had in about 15 minutes, unfortunately. Senator Mack. Well, I think we will go ahead, then. I've got an opening statement to make. And, then we will go to Mr. Saxton. You may have a statement to make. Representative Saxton. A very short one. Senator Mack. Then wewill go right to Senator Kyi. We have been debating the Balanced Budget Amendment on the Floor ofthe Senate for almost three weeks. In spite ofall the attempts we have seen to obscure and evade the issue, the real questions before us are simple andcannot be ignored. Do we want to balance the budget or not? And, do we want a largeror smaller Federal Government? Everything else is a distraction. The problem we face is enormous. President Clinton abdicated his fiscal responsibility to the American taxpayer when he sent Congress a budget with deficits for the next fiveyears totaling a trillion dollars. The 1994 election was about changing theway wedo business and can be summed up in one central message: We must get America's fiscal house in order. Nothing we can do is more critical to the public. And, nothing provokes voters" frustration with their government more than our failure to faceour financial problems squarely and do what needs to bedone. It is no wonder opponents ofthe Balanced Budget Amendment will do anything to avoid this fundamental issue. The old style champions ofbig government are trying to bog this debate down, because it's easier to hide behind a cloak of political rhetoric than to admit an addiction to big government spenduig. Let no one be fooled, for what matters now is whether we are really listening to the American people and whether we are serious enough about the problem to impose on ourselves the same kind of financial discipline thatevery family in America must follow. But, even ifwe all agree on the immensity ofthe problem and honor the wishes and the demands of the American people by passing the Balanced Budget Amendment, we are still left with the daunting task of actually balancing the budget. And, the question then becomes: How do we get there from here? Weneed a responsible process which will guarantee that spending cuts, not tax increases, will be made to balance the budget and provide outside restraints to protect the interests ofthe taxpayers. A number ofserious, responsible recommendations already have been offered. Today, the Committeewill focus on threeofthe most promising. A couple ofyears ago, 1 came up with the concept of a Government Spending Reduction Commission which would act as a fail-safe mechanism to ensure taxpayers that the budget will be balanced through spendingcuts, not tax increases. The bill is known as S.202. A little bit later in the morning, 1 am hopeful that Congressman Dan Miller will be here. He has introduced companion legislation in the House. And, he intends to discuss the plan with us. Later this morning. Senator Phil Gramm will testify to the Committee about his bill, S.I49, which would require a balanced budget by fiscal year 2002, while protecting social security, requiring zero-based budgeting and providing for program sunsettingevery 10 years. Finally, Senator Jon Kyi will discuss Senate Joint Resolution 3, his proposed Amendment to the Constitution, which would require that expenditures not exceed revenues for any given year nor exceed 19 percent ofthe previous year's gross national product. Since the Administration has walked away from its responsibilities, it is left to us in the Congress to cut government spending. But, ifwe cant muster the political will to get the job done, the taxpayer deserves a fail-safe mechanism to guarantee that spending cuts will be made. This is our chance to fundamentally change the way government does business and to show the Administration what reinventing government really means. I think this heanng is an important step forward toward keepnigour promise to the American people by making that change. And, now will turn to the Vice Chairman and ask him forhis openmg I statement. The prepared slalcmcnt ofSenator Mack appears in the Submissions for I the Record. S 202 can be found in the Senate Document Room.] Opening Statement of Representative Jim Saxton, Vice Chairman Representative Saxton. Well, thankyou, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate very much the opportunity to be here with you this morning to discuss what we all recognize as a cornerstone of the legislative agenda, the agenda ofthe American people forthis year. As everyone here knows, the House has passed a version of the Balanced Budget Amendment, which I think is an acceptable version to the great majority of the members of your House, the Senate. And, hopefully, you will be able to muster the 67 votes that are needed to send this on to the states. would point out by way ofobservation that the Government Spending I Revision Commission 1 think is a great idea, and that we ought to proceed to discuss it as one of the so-called enforcement mechanisms. I also understand the concept that Senator Kyi and others are talking about in terms ofa percentage ofgrowth andofGDP. There is also another approach that we might want to look at. It has to do with a spending limit, a super-majority to go over that spending limit. It's something that is being fleshed out in the House currently. And, it'sjust another thing for us to talk about along with the proposals that are already out there in terms ofmaking sure that once we get the Balanced Budget Amendment in place that we have an appropriate mechanism to make it work. And, so 1 look forward to hearing from the witnesses today, although I must say ahead of time that the House members are going to be back and forth, at best, because ofthe business ofthe floor today. But, thank you forholding this hearing. Wc appreciate it very much. I look forward to hearing from the witnesses. Senator Mack. Mr. Quinn. Opening Statement of Representative Jack Quinn Representative Quinn. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I, too, want to welcome our colleagues here who will be testifying in just a few short minutes. Mr. Chairman, wc passed our version over on the House side. And, as a former local elected official in the Town of Hamburg, New York, this issue, the Balanced Budget Amendment, is not a complicated one for our constituents Certainly, it's easy for them to understand. Local officials have to balance budgets. We dont need polls taken on this one. I am hopeful that we can get to the business ofconducting your work on the Senate side so that we can be back to our constituents all across this country to make sure that we can control the way we spend their money. So. I am pleased to have the panel here. And, I look forward to the testimony today. Thankyou. [The prepared statement of Representative Quinn appears in the Submissions forthe Record.] Senator Mack. Thank you. And, now we look forward to both the testimony ofSenator Kyi and Representative Miller. Senator Kyi, why don'tyou go ahead and proceed? Panel I Statement of the Honorable Jon Kyl, Senator from Arizona Senator Kyl. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and members of the Committee. 1 want to thank you for scheduling this hearing today to consider enforcement mechanisms that are needed to achieve a balanced Federal budget by theyear 2002.