Jim Marrs : The Rise of the Fourth Reich in America Laughlin, Nevada, February 2009 http://www.projectcamelot.net/jim_marrs_interview_transcript.html Jim Marrs (JM): ...and it was on the way to the printer, and then somebody somewhere just said: No. And it stopped. Bill Ryan (BR): I have a piece of off-record information for you, Jim, which we can go into backchannel if you want to. JM: Okay. BR: I have it in writing from Kit Green – that the remote viewing program was never closed down, and went underground... JM: Yeah. BR: ...with the use of drugs, hypnosis and electronics. I have this in writing. But maybe this is old news. Kerry Cassidy (KC): That‟s old news to Jim...! JM: What‟s wild though is, I‟ll tell you, here‟s my take: if you go ask somebody in government: Do you have a remote viewing unit? They‟re going to say: No. And, technically, I think they‟re telling the truth. Because when you say it went underground, what they did was they just spread it all out. Now, all these various organizations, such as Navy SEALS, Army Rangers and the DEA and all like that, they all have the remote viewers. BR: Mm hm. KC: That‟s right. JM: But it‟s not... they‟re not... They don‟t have a set, you know, official program of remote viewers, they just blended them all in with everybody else. Start of interview JM: Well, that‟s where I cut my teeth, as a working newspaperman in the Dallas, Fort Worth area, going all KC: This is Project Camelot – Kerry Cassidy and Bill Ryan the way back to the „60s. – and we‟re here with Jim Marrs. He‟s a very well known writer; very strong investigator. He‟s written several very KC: Amazing. So, you‟re also doing the circuit, you‟re well known books, very successful books: Crossfire and talking at various conferences, and we‟re here today at Rule by Secrecy and Alien Agenda and The Rise of the Laughlin – where the UFO Congress is being held – and Fourth Reich. you‟ve just given a wonderful speech. And we‟re actually here to talk to Jim about The Rise of So, what we want to do is talk about where America is the Fourth Reich. [speaking directly to Jim] We‟re going going from your point of view, get some of the to kind of concentrate on that area, but we want to go all background – the background, the Nazis and so on – and over the map, because I know that the secrets of remote what you‟ve been talking about in your newest book. And viewing is something you‟re very, very familiar with, also, then, sort of circle back around and talk a little bit and... about UFOs, the secrecy, and what might be seen in the future. You‟ve just covered the whole gamut – it‟s really amazing – and you do so in a very coherent way. It‟s very BR: I have a question of my own which I could add there understandable. I think that no one can read one of your as an adjunct, which is: why would somebody be talking books and go: Well that‟s the most outlandish thing I ever about The Rise of the Fourth Reich at a UFO conference? heard, it‟s not true. I think that basically you back up How‟s that for a question? everything you‟ve got to say. You were a journalist JM: [laughs] originally, is that right? KC: Well, okay, and I have to say that we‟re in some JM: Still am. [laughs] interesting times right now, that are actually bringing KC: Okay. Still working, a working journalist... forth this questioning that I think is... not even just UFO nuts, but political aficionados, the man on the street; JM: Right. everyone‟s questioning their reality right now, I think... KC: ...on top of your books, and... JM: I think... JM: Unfortunately there‟s no real journals around KC: ...and why what‟s happening in America is going on. anymore; [laughs] only corporate advertising delivery systems. JM: I think you‟re absolutely correct. Because of the crumbling economy, and because so many people are KC: Right, absolutely. And, basically, you‟re considered now waking up and realize that no matter whether they something of an expert on the Kennedy assassination as vote for a democrat or republican they seem to get the well, aren‟t you? same socialist programs, they are now beginning to Project Camelot – Jim Marrs - The Rise of the Fourth Reich in America – Feb 2009 1. realize that there is a whole different paradigm than what manna from heaven, the monochromatic gold, is portrayed in the corporate mass media. monotonomic... how do you say it? And so, the question is, why am I talking about The JM: The... [laughs] It‟s the single-atom gold, Fourth Reich at a UFO Congress? And I think the answer monatomic... monatomic gold. is because people who disregard the subject of UFOs and KC: Okay. who just write that off as just total fantasy and lunacy; they will never, ever, be able to figure out what‟s truly JM: Orbitally rearranged monatomic gold. Single-atom happening in the world because they‟re tossing out a big elements. These, by the way, this is nothing that‟s just piece of the puzzle. It‟s all part of the same big mosaic outrageous and unheard-of because monatomic gold, and you have to put all these pieces together to figure out silver, heavy metals – they‟re in everything. They‟re in what‟s going on. water, they‟re in food, we ingest them. This is just something else – another layer of our 3-D material Just as a “for instance”: I truly believe that one of the existence – that we had not been aware of prior to the main reasons for our precipitous invasion of Iraq was to „70s and „80s. But then, that‟s nothing new. You go back make a beeline for Baghdad, and use a mob scene as a a hundred years, they weren‟t aware of atoms. So, you cover, for a very concerted effort to loot the Iraqi National know, we‟re learning. Museum. What were they after? They were after newly discovered artifacts, tablets, scrolls and such that were I think the thing is, and the reason we need to look into being found in the ancient Sumerian cities of Uruk and this exotic stuff and the question of ETs is because I think some of these other places by French and German that we are in a conditioning process right now, that yes, archaeological teams – interestingly enough, the two there may be life in outer space, and this presents a countries who were most opposed to our entry into Iraq. danger. Because I know and I have seen the government documents. There are plans. Contingency plans and And what was taken? Very possibly knowledge of ancient government files that, at some point, when they can‟t energy manipulation technology. And this gets into anti- make the international enemy list work, is they... gravity and a bunch of weird and exotic technologies that conventional science would laugh at. But then, when you You know, at one point back in the early twentieth really study the issue, you find that these technologies century, it was the international Jewish conspiracy. Well, have been worked on since at least World War II and that fell apart. Then there was the international have been kept under very ultra-secret classification Communist conspiracy, and then that fell apart. Now it‟s programs ever since, because this is our leading edge the international terrorist conspiracy. And yet, if you stop technology. and think about it, how‟re we supposed to believe that‟s real when they will not do anything to secure the borders So, you can see how it all ties together; Ancient history, of the United States? So that‟s a sham too, and when that UFOs, secret societies, the world government. It‟s all part begins to fall apart, then – according to authoritarian of the same big ball of wax, and unless you back off and sources – the next thing is going to be a threat from take that broad overview and study a wide variety of outer space just like Ronald Reagan warned us about in topics, you‟re never going to figure out what‟s going on. his speech to the United Nations. BR: This is something that Bill Cooper said, I remember, So, if you don‟t want to be panicked and stampeded by in one of his very famous lectures that he gave in ‟89 or this phony threat from space, then you‟ll study the UFO ‟90 – you may well remember it yourself – he said: If you issue and you‟ll find out the truth about the issue. And don‟t factor UFOs into this jigsaw puzzle, you‟ll never then when they say: Oh, no, there really are aliens and understand what modern geopolitical events are all about. they‟re coming to eat you and you have to give up all the KC: Aren‟t we also talking about star gates and, you rest of your liberties so we can protect you, you can say: know, because when you get into free energy, you get Nah, I don‟t think so. into – from what I understand – vortexes, and you get KC: Right, absolutely. So, through remote viewing... You into the possibility there is a star gate in Iraq as well that became a remote viewer yourself, is that right? they might be covering up. And then you get into the Annunaki, and... so you‟re into aliens or ETs, whatever JM: I have... In my study of remote viewing, I did you want to call them. Have you gone down that road at participate in some remote viewing studies and in some all? testing and, interesting enough, I tested pretty well [laughs]. JM: Well, sure. When you follow the evidence, that‟s where it takes you back to. And we mentioned the KC: I‟m not surprised, because you‟ve got a great sort of possibility of a star gate or some sort of dimensional objectivity about the way you look at different topics, and portal in Iraq, you know, that takes me back to the Bible from what I understand –I studied remote viewing a little and the story of King Nebuchadnezzar. He built this myself – and I understand that it really takes sort of an structure out of gold, which they translate as a fiery impartial look at what‟s in, you know, on the other side, furnace, but obviously it was something else because so to speak. people went in and out of it. JM: I was kind of surprised to find out that I tested so Of course, when his people when in, they tended to keel well in remote viewing. But then as I thought about it, it over and die, which tells me it was some sort of an really wasn‟t that surprising because as a journalist and a energy field. Then he got the three Hebrew priests and newspaperman I had long-since learned to somewhat told them to make it work, and put them in there. And, lo trust my intuition... and behold, eventually there was four people in there. So KC: You have to. three went in and four [laughs] came out, so obviously they were opening some sort of a portal, or a gateway. JM: ... and my intuition rarely let me down. And that‟s, of course, that‟s getting to the soft psychic signal that‟s at KC: Wow. That‟s very interesting. So, where do you want the heart of the remote viewing experience. to take us with this? Because I know that there‟s a whole movement in your speech, where you‟re talking about Project Camelot – Jim Marrs - The Rise of the Fourth Reich in America – Feb 2009 2. KC: Absolutely. So, where are you with that? As far as end result‟s the same, a blending of corporate and state using that in what you‟re kind of... you‟re going down this power, which is fascism. road, you‟re investigating the Nazi connection behind our Now after eight years of this fascism, people were government and what‟s going on now in America, and... beginning to chafe. Even the people who thought they So how does the remote viewing help you in that journey? really wanted to support George W. Bush because he said JM: Well, it‟s [laughs] actually not much at all, which is all the right things began to realize that all he was doing surprising and probably pretty stupid. But it‟s like, you was pushing socialist programs and waging unprovoked know, I know I should exercise a whole lot more than I do wars of aggression. So there was a backlash, and now we but I just don‟t because I‟m too busy doing other things, have shifted from National Socialism to Marxist Socialism, and it‟s the same thing with remote viewing. I really under Barack Obama. probably should sit down, at least once a day, and try to But nothing really has changed, because in the Bush W. keep my remote viewing skills up to razor edge but I administration all the top important people were members don‟t, [laughs] because... of the secretive Council on Foreign Relations, which has KC: But you are using your intuition, right? dominated U.S. foreign policy since before World War II and was created for the express purpose of bringing in a JM: Right. world government. And under the Barack Obama KC: In your investigations... administration we find that all of his top cabinet members, they‟re all members of the Council on Foreign JM: It‟s helped me learn to even give more trust to my Relations. So the very same secretive, wealthy elite is still intuition. running this country, only now under the guise of Marxist KC: Right. So, where are we going as a country right Socialism. now, and why? And after four years of Marxist Socialism and the JM: The United States has always been – at least been attendant collapse, probably, of the U.S. economy, then attempted to be – dominated by a wealthy elite, and that we‟re going to be all set up to really go for a new dictator goes all the way back. Alexander Hamilton and his rich – a new Führer – as people, in their panic over the friends, they wanted to run the country, because they felt economy and over the social programs, they will swing like that the rich people knew how to handle things and back and vote for some dictator. This is the same somehow had better sense than everybody else. So, methodology that was used in pre-war Germany; by the that‟s nothing new, and as a result the United States has same people. always had a somewhat conservative bend to it. And KC: Ok. Well, enter free energy into that scenario and that‟s ok too, because „specially when you have a great what do you get? Because we do see the destruction of country with... full of resources and everybody‟s the American economy; we see the World economy going prospering and, you know, you want to... let‟s conserve down, as a matter of fact. But where does free energy everything we have. kind of fit into this puzzle, if you will, and certainly it‟s in So there‟s nothing inherently wrong with that. But, Black Projects, as we know and we‟ve documented in unfortunately, with the influx of National Socialists – various videos with various people. which in the German language the acronym of which is I know you‟re involved in working with Gordon Novel and NAZI – with the influx of Nazis after World War II, being the RAM Project, on some level, although I‟m not sure aided and abetted and funded by Wall Street financiers how. So maybe you could..? So that puts you in a really and people who consider themselves globalists, they have interesting position to view how free energy is coming no particular interest in the United States, per se; they into this puzzle. want to try to run the world. JM: Right. Well, there are several question marks in the First into the military industrial complex, and then into whole equation, and free energy is obviously one of them. the defense industries, and then into academia, and then If we could break the stranglehold of the monopoly of into other professions, this National Socialism has been petrochemicals and come up with some sort of a free worming its way into the United States since after World energy, the whole equation would change. And this is War II. And it really came to fore when George Herbert what‟s going on right now. There are some very, very Walker Bush became President – whose grandfather was intense, interdicting and covert conflicts going on over actually prosecuted by the Federal Government of the which technology that we want to go to; who‟s going to United States in late 1942 for being a financial front man control it. for Hitler and the Nazis – and then his son, George W. For example, we hear talk of fuel cells for vehicles. The And during the eight years of the George W. reason we don‟t have it yet is because they haven‟t administration we saw the rise and the dominance of Neo- figured out yet how to get a monopoly over it. So this, Cons, or Neo-Conservatives, which is nothing less than again, is going to depend on how the future paradigm just another name for National Socialism. So we saw this begins to shape up. I would like to see some sort of whole country tend towards the right; towards fascism. economy set up that‟s not monopoly based; that And because fascism is defined as the blending of state everyone has a little bit of everything. and corporate power, I don‟t think there‟s anyone who can argue that that‟s not the case in the United States In fact, to give you an example: to me, the biggest today. example – and proof – of conspiracy in the world today is the fact that even while people are sitting here watching The big difference is, in Nazi Germany, the state gained this interview, in the back of their mind they realize that control over the corporations, and it was that combination somewhere there are literally thousands – if not millions that created that fascist state; and in modern America we – of children starving to death. Now, is it because the have the corporations gaining control over the state Earth cannot produce enough food to feed those children? through lobbyists and through pacts and through the No, of course not. We have the technology that we could groups that... they now control the government. But the feed and clothe and house and give reasonable, minimal health care to every single person on this planet. Project Camelot – Jim Marrs - The Rise of the Fourth Reich in America – Feb 2009 3. KC: Mm hm. and to spread the wealth, to where everyone could have a little piece of the American Dream. JM: So, why don‟t we? Well, once you get past the facile explanations such as: Oh, it‟s politics, and it‟s KC: Well, wouldn‟t you say, though, that there‟s some transportation, and the cost is great, and you know... get kind of plan afoot to take down the American government past that. It‟s that way because somewhere somebody altogether? I mean, that‟s actually what‟s being fought wants it that way. If nobody wanted it that way, it behind the scenes? wouldn‟t be that way. There‟s more of us than there are JM: That‟s absolutely true and that‟s what‟s going on. of these New World Order people. We simply need to get Because the United States has been the biggest stumbling all the people of good conscience and good heart together block to these globalists who want to see a one world and say: We don‟t want it that way. government, one world socialist system. The reason for KC: Absolutely. Well, okay. But there is a ruling elite, that is because in the United States we have a tradition right? and history of individual freedom. And we have the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, which gives us a legal JM: Right. basis for our individual freedom and liberty. And three, we KC: And you‟ve delved into that, I‟m sure, in… have guns and we can see to ourselves that we have individual freedom and liberty. JM: Right, and I‟ve detailed them and tracked their history. But right now there are... there‟s a movement afoot under the new Obama administration to register firearms, KC: Okay, so you‟re talking about – just for the of the to register ammunition, and to basically try to disarm the video – Bilderbergers, Council on Foreign Relations, population. And if that ever comes to fruition, then we‟re certainly Majestic 12, and I know you‟re... just going to become serfs in a new Middle Age of JM: Trilateral Commission... feudalism. KC: ...you‟re something of an expert on them, right? KC: Well, what about China, you know, because there‟s talk that China may be set to invade at some point in the JM: Mm hm. future; that we may be having war with China. Have you KC: So, all of these organizations are rolling out an heard anything to that effect? agenda right now, and the question is: how soon is what JM: Well, you know, some Chinese generals are even on they‟re going to accom... are they going to be done the public record saying war with the United States is accomplishing this, you know, Fourth Reich, if you call it, inevitable. I don‟t know why. Right now we‟re totally in your opinion? Is this something... are we already dependent on each other. We‟re dependent on China to there? produce just about everything that we use. You know, go JM: We‟re very, very close to a Fourth Reich, because into any store and pick up a product and look on the “reich” in German simply means “empire”, and the United bottom and it‟ll say Made in China. States today, of course, is the preeminent empire on the KC: Right. planet. It‟s going to be up to us, the members of the empire – citizens of the empire – whether we act as an JM: Okay, but then, likewise, they‟re dependent upon us empire and become the imperial empire, in which case because if we‟re not there to buy all this junk from them we‟re probably going to take a fall just like the Roman [laughs] they don‟t have a market. So, I think that some Empire, just like the Third Reich and everybody else. Or, of this belligerence is concocted. Because actually... do we try to bring peace, prosperity to everybody instead KC: Absolutely. of trying to lord it over and hog the resources of the planet. And it‟s basically just kind of a consciousness JM: If you want to know what the... Here‟s the real game shift, is what it is. plan, okay? A good illustration is in my home state of Texas. When I KC: Okay. was a kid the highways were just terrible. They were JM: This was articulated back in 1948 by a man named littered because people just, you know, you got through Eric Arthur Blair, who was a British Fabian Socialist and with your drink, you just threw it out the window. And it very well connected to the royals and to the aristocracy wasn‟t that we thought we were littering and were trying there in England. And I think he actually had a pretty to do bad, we just didn‟t know any better. We just said: good view on what the overall game plan was, so he Ah well, I‟m through with that and it‟s out the window. wrote it all down in a book under the pen name George But they instituted a Don‟t Mess with Texas program; Orwell. signs everywhere, and they raised the consciousness. And KC: [laughs] Okay. people began to realize: Wait, it‟s not really right to throw all your trash out on the highway. And I‟m not going to JM: And, of course, that was 1984. try and say that highways in Texas today are spotless, KC: Right. but they are 150 percent better than what they used to be, and not because of any of the littering laws – JM: And in there, if you‟ll go back and re-read 1984, although they‟re on the books, but I don‟t know of you‟ll find that they had divided the world into three anybody that‟s ever gotten a ticket for littering – but the economic blocks. In 1984 they called it Oceania, Asiana consciousness raising; and we could do the same thing and East Asiana. In today‟s real world it‟s the European with the people of the United States. Union, the soon to be North American Union and the future Asian Union. And then what they did is they play The people of the United States are good people. We give two of those blocks off against each other perpetually to more to charity than all the other nations of the world create the tension necessary for arms races, and for combined. And if we simply understood the truth of the defense spending, and lots of loans going through; that situation and we‟re not being pushed from pillar to post generates profit and control over the population. by the corporate-controlled mass media, then I think we could probably figure out ways to handle the situation, KC: Right. Project Camelot – Jim Marrs - The Rise of the Fourth Reich in America – Feb 2009 4. JM: That‟s the game plan. demanded it, and if we wanted it, and if we could convince these would-be rulers of the world that we all KC: Okay, well that‟s a great overview of what‟s in deserve to have a fair shake at life. operation right now. Do you believe that there‟s also... ah, you know, the Georgia Guidestones; basically what KC: Absolutely. they say, which is elimination of the population is one of BR: I have a nice little anecdote that you might be able their objectives? to use in some of your lectures. In the Marquesas Islands JM: Right. Whoever build the Georgia Guidestones, again in the South Pacific – it‟s a French colony which no one‟s I think, was privy to this New World Order agenda. And ever heard of. In their language, they have no word for this is where I do depart from their thinking. I have an work. And it‟s a really wonderful concept... interview with General Maxwell Taylor that was done in JM: Right. the early „70s and he – being not only our last ambassador to Vietnam but also a ranking member of the BR: ...because, of course, we think the way we talk, it‟s Council on Foreign Relations – I think he was fully not the other way round. And so, they don‟t work. They articulating their thinking. catch a fish, they build a house and they light a fire, then they cook a meal and they dance and they do this, and He said, basically, that by the beginning of the next they just live. And this whole work/play dialectic has century – well that‟s now – he said we have to eliminate actually been so deeply ingrained into us in this Western about a third of the world‟s population because, he said, society... the basic overall problem is overpopulation. And that lays at the heart of all the other problems; pollution and JM: Right... economy and everything. And he said this will be done by BR: ...that we‟re victims of this idea; that we‟re limited regional conflicts like Iraq, [laughs] Afghanistan... prisoners... KC: Uh-huh. JM: Right. JM: ...disease – AIDS in Africa – and starvation, which is BR: ... because we‟ve got to work all the time, and then prevalent in many of the Third World nations. And he we‟ve got to play, and then they‟ve got us by the throat... said: I‟m not sure we can save these people, and I‟m not even sure we should try. And so, that is their thinking to JM: That‟s right. decrease the world‟s population. BR ...because we all try to get out of this loop. Now, here‟s the fallacy in their thinking: there really is no JM: And if you have a son or daughter and all they want overpopulation problem. I heard this stated some years to do is play the guitar and write music, then they must ago – I didn‟t quite believe it, so I checked – but it‟s be some kind of bum – [Kerry laughs] – because they‟re absolutely true. The entire 6.5 billion human population not working! could actually live comfortably enough in the state of Texas. KC: Right. KC: [laughs] Really? JM: Now, there was a great story, there was a great story about the retired American businessman who goes JM: Really. So, it‟s not a overpopulation problem, it‟s a down to Mexico, and he rents a little fishing boat and he population concentration problem. You have most of the goes out fishing. And he gets to talking with Manuel, the world is jammed into these huge metropolitan areas, big guy that owns the boat, and he says: Manuel, you know, mega-cities, okay? he says: what‟s your life like? What do you do? KC: Right. He says: Oh, I get up in the morning, and he says: and I JM: There are other ways of doing things, okay? I could come out and do some fishing, then I go home and take a picture a world where you and Bill could live out in a siesta in the afternoon with my wife, and at night I go beautiful countryside, a rural setting, okay? Got your little into town and sit with my friends and eat and drink and lake there, and you‟ve got an orchard, and you‟ve got a play the guitar and we sing. garden, and you‟re just doing great. And when it‟s time to He says: Well, Manuel, he said: Don‟t you understand, if go shopping, then you get on your bicycle or your little you don‟t take a siesta, if you‟d fish more during the day electric cart and you go down to the little station and you you‟d make more money and with that more money you hop a high-speed electric line – zoom! – that would take could buy another boat. And with two boats then, you you to a shopping centre area, like a huge mall. And you know, you‟d get more fish and pretty soon you could buy go through there and you do your shopping, okay, and more boats. And the next thing you know you‟ll have a then you zoom back home and get on your bicycle, pedal fleet of boats. And then what you do, is you come to the back to your little place. United States and then you can incorporate, and then you And you have your own little energy collector generator, can sell stock, and then you can have a whole fleet of alright? You‟re self-sufficient energy-wise. And you say: boats and you can make, you know... and pretty soon you Yeah, but what do I do for work? Well it would be could become a millionaire. whatever you wanted to do. And he says: how long would that take? He says: Ah, We‟re in an awkward situation now because we‟ve all twenty, thirty years. been brought up on this Christian work ethic that says He said: And then what‟d I do? He says: Well, then you everybody‟s got to work. Okay? Well that‟s a product of could retire and come to Mexico, and fish in the morning older times when truly everybody had to work just to and take a siesta in the afternoon, and visit your friends survive. In fact, that‟s why you had to have lots of kids, at night... because you had to have somebody work the fields, so you could produce produce, so you‟d have food to eat. And it‟s like: Oh, wait a minute! [laughs] But today with technology, you know, just a few mega- KC: [laughs] farms can raise enough food for everybody. The technology‟s there. We could all be living like kings if we JM: He‟s already doing that... Project Camelot – Jim Marrs - The Rise of the Fourth Reich in America – Feb 2009 5. KC: Yeah... I see. interesting. Basically, they have to destroy the United States, okay? And what they‟re trying to do is wreck the JM: So, it‟s all in the mind. It‟s all in the consciousness economy, panic the people, and get everybody to accept and how we perceive things and whether or not you think the North American Union. And to do this... you have to be in the rat race, and whether or not you think you have to have more toys than everybody else so The way they‟ll do this is by saying the only way out of you can prove that you‟re a success. The most successful this economic mess is to combine the economies of people I know are not necessarily the richest people I Mexico, Canada, and the United States. And, of course, know. we‟ve all heard talk of the Amero, which I have conflicting information, and of course you see pictures on the KC: Oh, yeah, definitely! Well, I mean, that‟s a very good internet, and they say: Oh, here it is, and it‟s here now, point. Also, the idea is, behind free energy, if you want and yet, that‟s apparently not the case. That‟s just some to call it that, that the energy sources could make that coins people have struck as kind of a gimmick or a possible for everyone. trinket. But I also have heard from people that I feel like JM: Well, we‟ve had this for a long, long, long time. know what they‟re talking about, that the Amero money is Nikola Tesla was trying to tell us how we could tap the already printed and waiting; awaiting distribution. basic energy of the earth and everyone could just have This is very reminiscent of some years ago. I heard... their own energy. Of course, he got shut down by Edison there was internet rumors running around about this Red and by the people who wanted to put in the electrical Money. Money that was going to be pinkish in color and systems and make sure that you buy energy. And today, have red ink and dyes in it, you know, like that. And the see, they‟ve got a lock on it because, you know, you government denied that, and they said: No, that‟s not could be Bill Gates, you could be the richest guy in the right, that‟s not true. And yet, now it is, you know, we do whole world, but he still pays an electric bill each month. have this, the new money and it is reddish and pinkish KC: Mm hm. and all like that. So, you know... JM: It all comes back to perception and consciousness. KC: But states are not going to fall for this, it doesn‟t Years ago, I got really big on solar energy, you know, and sound like. And even... I said: Well, you know, gee, either the sun shines or it JM: They are balking. They're balking and they‟re doesn‟t. If it doesn‟t, we‟re all out of luck, and if it‟s bucking in the traces, and that‟s good. The thing is, this is shining, then why don‟t we capture the sun‟s radiant the salvation, okay? We are not going to change the energy and use that for energy. federal structure of the United States; it‟s too entrenched, So I was talking with an energy expert and he very it‟s too bureaucratic, too many people are feeding at the patiently and condescendingly explained to me that: Well, trough, and they‟re not just going to voluntarily get up you don‟t understand. He said: It would take solar panels and go away. covering an area the size of the state of Arizona to KC: Right. provide enough power to power the city of Los Angeles. JM: And obviously, even by voting you‟re not going to And I thought: Oh, okay. And I checked him out, and get anything changed much. In 2004, they voted in a that‟s probably true. Where‟s the flaw in his thinking? democratic Congress trying to curb the excesses of the Central generation. He can only think in terms of central Bush administration, and what changed? Nothing! We‟re generation... still in Iraq fighting, we‟re still in Afghanistan fighting... KC: Sure... KC: Right, and we‟re bailing people out – or companies JM: ...generating that juice and piping it to L.A. What if out, not people... everybody in L.A. put a solar panel on their roof? JM: Exactly. KC: And sun is so plentiful there that, you know... KC: ...to much greater sums than ever thought of. JM: There you go! JM: And, the Bush administration, which was hailed as KC: ...they could gather enough energy... the epitome of good conservatism, is the one that nationalized the banking business, you know. [laughs] JM: That‟s right. Socialism, right down the line. KC: ...in a matter of days, really. KC: Well, isn‟t the bottom line that the two party system JM: Exactly. And why don‟t they do that? Because, the was just a fallacy anyway, because... electric company... JM: It‟s pretty much always been a joke... KC: No one would make money. KC: ...it‟s always... JM: The electric company hasn‟t figured out how to make JM: ... but it‟s definitely a joke now. Particularly, I guess a cloud come hang over your house if you don‟t pay your it‟s summed up in the election of 2006. You could vote for electric bill[Kerry laughs]Okay? So, it‟s all about power Democrat John Kerry, who was from an oil family and a and control, it‟s not about technology. member of the secretive Skull and Bones Society; or you KC: So, yeah, absolutely, and this is the paradigm that could vote for his cousin George W. Bush, from an oil humans are operating under at the moment. family and a member of the Skull and Bones Society. There‟s no choice. JM: Right. KC: Yeah. KC: So, where is the United States headed in your estimation? Because in some places right now we have JM: There‟s no difference, and anybody who still pays Native American tribes that are trying to secede from the attention to Democrat and Republican, they‟re just getting Union, in essence, create their own currency... snookered. JM: We got 21 states now that have sovereignty bills KC: Okay, so to get back to this situation. So you have... pending; they‟re trying to cut loose. It‟s going to get real you‟ve got these families that are running everything. Project Camelot – Jim Marrs - The Rise of the Fourth Reich in America – Feb 2009 6. You‟ve got an agenda to take down the United States, but The truth of the matter is, is that the very same people in the United States is not going to go. I mean, you know, Wall Street and the city of London – these people are... they‟re actually incredible citizens; they Internationalists, these global financiers – they created actually want to save the country... Communism in Russia. When the Russian Revolution broke out Lenin was in Switzerland. Trotsky was in New JM: Right. York living on Rockefeller property, okay? They sent them KC: They‟re patriots, if you will... into Russia to capture the Revolution for the Bolsheviks and turn Russia into a communist state, which they did. JM: Right. And the idea was, I think, to build up a communist East KC: So... versus a capitalist West, and they were going to perpetuate the Cold War many years before we actually JM: The problem is they‟re all divided, okay? saw it actually come into being. KC: Okay. But the problem was, it threatened to get out of hand. JM: And like, I‟ve traveled around the country, and I‟ve There were strong Communist parties in France, England, found pockets of people everywhere who understand Italy, Germany – even the United States. And so they... what‟s going on, who care about what‟s going on, who we talk about this One World Government, but they really want to do something about it. But they all feel like, that don‟t want a true One World Government, because then they‟re in the minority and that they‟re all alone because they can‟t play one nation off against another, or one these people control the mass media. economic block off against another. So this made them fearful, and they decided they had to stop the spread of KC: Mm hm. Communism. JM: And this is why, by the way, that you‟ve... When is The one country that was in a position geographically and the last time you heard a national politician refer to the economically to act as a block against the spread of Republic? They don‟t even talk about the Republic Communism was Germany. So they went in and found a anymore... German army intelligence agent, and they put him in KC: No. charge of a little political party called the German Worker‟s Party which he quickly changed the name to the JM: ... because we‟re not a republic anymore; we‟re just National Socialist German Worker‟s Party (NSDAP) – the the Empire. And all they talk about is democracy, acronym of which is NAZI – and, of course, that was Adolf democracy. We have to protect democracy; we got to Hitler. And Hitler provided this block against the spread of spread democracy. Well what‟s democracy? It‟s ruled by Communism. Then they perpetrated this whole idea of the the majority; so, in other words, the epitome of Nazis were bitter enemies of the Communists, okay? democracy in action is a lynch mob. KC: And meanwhile, they‟re being financed by Bush... KC: Mm hm. JM: And run by the same people... JM: Well, that‟s not what we were given. We were not given a democracy; we don‟t want a pure democracy. We KC: ...Prescott Bush, behind the scenes... want a democratic republic; and what‟s the difference? JM: Exactly, yeah, and the Rockefellers... Because in the democratic republic, if you‟re charged with a capital crime then you have to... you get to face your KC: ...and I – what is it – Farben? accusers, you get to have legal representation, you get to JM: IG Farben. go into a court/legal system, and you get to cross- examine the evidence against you; you get to have a fair KC: IG Farben. trial. And then if you‟re found guilty and you have a JM: And the head of IG Farben was Hermann Schmitz, chance for an appeal, and it‟s turned down, then they can and Hermann Schmitz owned as much Standard Oil stock lynch you. as John D. Rockefeller did. It was all the same KC: [laughs] International globalists, if you will. Now the problem was, is that Hitler got too strong and the Germans were a little JM: Okay? too efficient, and they over-ran Europe. They were KC: Right... moving into North Africa, they were pushing into Russia, taking over Norway, and were threatening Britain. JM: That‟s the way it‟s supposed to work. But we are no longer a rule of... a nation ruled by law. Now all of a sudden it looked like they were going to have a One World National Socialist system. And oh, they KC: Right. The corporations basically rule... didn‟t want that either! But mostly they didn‟t want JM: Corporations tell us what to do. And again, it‟s that Germany in charge of the world economic order because takeover-of-the-state mechanism by corporations; it‟s the this had been the purview of the city of London – those very dictionary definition of fascism. bankers with the Bank of England – and their Wall Street compadres, okay? KC: So let‟s get back into what happened during the time of Paperclip, and during the time of the Atomic Bomb, and So, at some point, even though they had created Hitler, maybe you could talk a little bit about what really went on put him into power, financed his rise; they turned against back then because I think a lot of people need to get their him, and that‟s when we had World War II. They history, you know, straightened out in their heads. managed to stop Germany, push it back. And yes, we defeated Germany in World War II, but we didn‟t defeat JM: They really do, because in our conventional history, the Nazis. The Nazis were still much in power, and they it‟s like: Well, there was the Russian Revolution, and then cut deals. They swapped their exotic technology, their out of that grew Communism, and then they... we had a rocket technology, their energy manipulation technology, Cold War with them versus Capitalism and yadda-yadda- their mind control technology, chemical technology and yadda... pharmaceutical technology to the United States in exchange for immunity. Project Camelot – Jim Marrs - The Rise of the Fourth Reich in America – Feb 2009 7. We brought them in over the war and in the late „40s and JM: The Vril Society. And this was largely based on the early „50s, John J. McCloy – who had been head of philosophies of Madame Blatavsky and her Theosophical National City Bank which was one of the largest lenders of Society. They were heavy into that. And, of course, Hitler money to pre-World War II Nazi Germany – was made was put into power with the help of the Thule- High Commissioner of Germany. He pardoned thousands Gesellschaft, or the Thule Society, which was an occult of unreconstructed Nazis; brought them over to the society made up of some of the wealthiest aristocrats United States. there in Germany, and industrialists. They were big into this stuff, into spiritualism, I think, is what they called it His protégé was Allen Dulles, who then was head of the back then. CIA for many years. And under Dulles, he whitewashed their backgrounds, and put them all – these Nazis – into And so they... according to the information I have there our military industrial complex. And that began the was even a unit within the German military called Doctor National Socialist infiltration of the United States system. Greenbaum, and this was basically their remote viewers. And, interestingly enough, this was under a broader KC: Wow, that‟s an excellent summation of really what umbrella program called Majik [he spells] M-A-J-I-K. happened behind the scenes. And this is what most people don‟t know... And that‟s really interesting because, as you well know, the Majestic 12 – or Majik 12 – that‟s always talked about JM: No, you‟re never taught this in school. in the UFO literature being the people at the top who are KC: ...about American history... in charge of the secrecy over UFO technology was M-A-J- I-C 12 to begin with; which is the anglicized version of M- JM: Right... A-J-I-K – the German version. And I‟m wondering if KC: ...and even the history of the world. So you also perhaps, when we brought their mind control experts and could talk about what the Nazis had by virtue of their their pharmaceutical experts and their rocket scientists all occult investigations, and possibly even channeling, and over here after the war, if we didn‟t bring some of their how they got what is, in essence, free energy – maybe psychic scientists, too. even star gate technology, certainly UFOs. KC: Okay, that makes sense. Well, what about Vannover JM: Exotic technology. Bush? He was head of Majestic 12 that was set up by the Truman... supposedly set up by the Truman KC: Yeah. administration, right? JM: Yeah, and the question‟s always been: How did the JM: Mm hm. It was. Nazis get so far ahead of us in science? KC: To handle the problem of UFOs and what it meant to KC: Exactly. America, but... JM: They were broadcasting the 1936 Berlin Olympics JM: Right. over television. In fact, by the end of the war, they had television-guided missiles. Holy cow! We didn‟t know KC: ...that‟s a very interesting trail to follow if they that... and there‟s good reason to believe they actually already were in operation in Germany. possessed and had tested a nuclear weapon. But by the JM: Right, exactly. And you have to understand that that time... they did not have a reliable delivery system, and really was the genesis of the modern National Security by the time they were ready to maybe unleash a nuclear state – the National Security Act of 1947, which began to weapon, it was spring of 1945 and the Russians were be put together just a few days after something fell from closing in from the east and Allies from the west, and it the skies at Roswell, New Mexico in July of 1947. And, by was almost all over. And if they had set off an atomic August, they're cobbling together quickly this National bomb somewhere it would not have ended the war, it Security Act, and in September they actually held would‟ve simply meant the total devastation and President Truman – delayed him on the tarmac there at destruction of Germany. National Airport when he was trying to get home to visit Now, where did they get all this? For years I‟d heard his dying mother – so they could rush on board and get stories that: Well, they captured a flying saucer him to sign this National Security Act of 1947. somewhere and they back-engineered it. But yet, every Why the rush? Well, because they had to get control over time you try to track those stories, it never went all of this information. What the National Security Act of anywhere. And I am now of the opinion, based on 1947 did was create the CIA and also change the name of information that I have now, and based on documentation the Defense Depart... War Department to the Defense that has come out of the old Soviet Union now with the Department; a little public relations move. collapse of Communism, that the Germans had their own remote viewers. But also in there – and what has been little noticed – was the creation of the National Security Council. Well, by BR: Mm hm. very definition, that‟s in charge of anything that has to do JM: Of course, they didn‟t call it remote viewing, because with national security. UFOs? National security. Nazi that was a term that was coined back when the CIA and infiltration? National security. High technology? National the National Security Agency in this country was studying security. and working with psychic warfare. But they had the same And, since the National Security Council – and we hear type thing. Back then the Germans had been very much this all the time, almost any time that we‟ve gone to fight involved in the occult, if you want to call it that, all the some brushfire war and the Iran-Contra scandal, on and way back in... prior to the 1920s. And they would have on – it‟s always the National Security Council is involved. séances, and they would have all of these channelings, or And yet, I‟ll bet you virtually no one listening knows who whatever you want to call it, but at the bottom line of it is is the National Security Council. Well I‟ll tell you. It‟s four what we call remote viewing. It was the use of these people: it‟s the President, the Vice President, the psychic abilities. Secretaries of State and Defense. Three of those are BR: This was the Vril Society, wasn‟t it? appointed by the President. Project Camelot – Jim Marrs - The Rise of the Fourth Reich in America – Feb 2009 8. KC: Mm hm. JM: ...you know, because they‟re trying to get to this ancient technology. JM: So by signing the National Security Act of 1947 into law, we basically set up a dictatorship, because the KC: Okay, so, you just spent some time in Egypt, didn‟t President is now in charge of everything that has to do you? with national security, and this bypasses Congress and JM: Yes. the news media and the public. This is when we began to move into a National Security state which, at the heart of KC: And did you find anything when you were there – which, lay these Nazis – unreconstructed Nazis. [Jim laughs] – that blew your mind, or... KC: So, to get back to Germany, you have them JM: Yes. Under the Temple of Seti – which is an discovering free energy somehow. I mean certainly they immense temple and just filled with hieroglyphics – had really amazing scientists... underneath that, is a huge temple called the Osireion. And it is huge megalithic blocks that probably weigh ten JM: Right. and twelve tons each. No hieroglyphics on these, but KC: Okay. And they were looking into other dimensions they‟re stacked up very similar to Stonehenge. using psychics, using remote viewing, using possible But they are not rough rock like Stonehenge, these are channeling. And what you‟re saying is they may have perfectly, finely cut pieces that butt up against each other been also getting technology out of those dimensions; so perfectly you can‟t even put a piece of paper in there. information that they needed to build things. And this is under the Temple of Seti, which means there JM: Right. was something going on over there long before the Egyptians came along. KC: Right? KC: Are they releasing this into the public domain? JM: Mm hm. JM: No. In fact, we weren‟t even supposed to be able to KC: And there is a connection to Egypt, right? And to the go down there [laughs], but we managed to kind of slip Sumerians... to Sumerians‟ cylinder seals... down there and see what was going on. This is the stuff JM: A lot of this is – all of this – is part of... they keep hidden. The same thing is that – on the Sphinx – it is just obvious that there is deep water erosion KC: A lot of the technology's back there. grooves on the sides of the Sphinx and on the sides of the JM: ...the Earth‟s history. ground surrounding it, which means that this is vertical water erosion. the Sphinx and the area around it had sat KC: Right. out under heavy rains. JM: And it all fits together. For example: for the longest KC: You actually got into this place, which is under the time everybody thought that Egypt was the world‟s first, Temple of Seti, you‟re saying, which is built like greatest civilization. Well, you know, that‟s because it Stonehenge, has polished stones... wasn‟t until the mid-1800s that they began to discover these strange mounds over in Mesopotamia – which is JM: Right. No hieroglyphics, it obviously predates the now modern-day Iraq – and they began to excavate and Seti Temple, and so this, again, more proof that there find that there's huge cities under there. was something going on of a highly technological nature long before the Egyptians came along. And they began to discover the Sumerian civilization which predates the Egyptians by at least five thousand KC: So, do they know, are they dating it at all? Has years. So what we‟re actually finding out today is, is that anybody... did anybody give you an indication when, what apparently there was, in antediluvian times, a worldwide, it was dated? highly technological civilization that probably covered the JM: No. There is a huge resistance to all of this, and I entire world. This is why they found pyramids in Central couldn‟t quite understand the resistance until I visited in America, South America, China, Eastern Europe, the Giza Egypt and realized that they‟re totally dependent upon Plateau... the tourist dollar and upon the whole idea of the Pharaohs And yet, something happened. There was either Earth and Cleopatra and Nefertiti and da-da-da-da-da-da-da... changes, or there was a war or something, and this whole and they just really can‟t afford to back off of that. civilization crumbled. And what we know is our written They don‟t want to admit that there was anything going history: the Sumerians, and then the Babylonians, and on other than the conventional history. And, of course, then the Assyrians, and then the Phoenicians, and then everyone else who‟s an Egyptologist or whatever – the Egyptians and... they‟ve got an entire lifetime, they‟ve got books written, These were all degradations of the same civilization. And they‟ve got a whole career based on their theories and the proof of that, for example, is in the history of Egypt. their interpretation of what the Egyptians were doing. And The earliest dynasties were the most advanced dynasties, to say that that really wasn‟t quite the truth of it, then and then it devolved, [laughs] it degraded. And went all that just throws it all into a cocked hat, and they‟re totally the way down until we ended up in the Middle – in the opposed to that. Dark Ages, and then we‟ve been slowly pulling ourselves However, the geologists who go and look at this very out ever since. And this is why that the people in the obvious water erosion on the Sphinx will tell you that know – and knowledge is power, and they want to keep that‟s obviously water erosion, and historically, there‟s the knowledge, and they don‟t want us to know what‟s not been any heavy rains on the Giza Plateau for 10,500 going on – but this is why they are rushing around the years. Which means the Sphinx, and probably the Great whole world just like Indiana Jones chasing the Nazis, Pyramid, predate the Egyptians by at least 5,000 years. who were chasing the historic and religious... And five thousand years, you know, it‟s hard for us to KC: The icons and... think of five thousand years. JM: ...icons, yeah, and artifacts... KC: [laughs] KC: ...yeah, absolutely. Project Camelot – Jim Marrs - The Rise of the Fourth Reich in America – Feb 2009 9. JM: Most people today think about the war between the proved that moving those stones was done by a whole states, you know, that just sounds like ancient history. different means than what they talked about with... And yet, my grandmother told me about when her father JM: Right. came back from the war. So it really hasn‟t been that far back. And yet to us it‟s ancient history, and that was, KC: ...slave labor in Egypt and all of that. what, only about a hundred and fifty years ago. So to talk JM: Right. about five thousand years; my God, we just... we have a hard time even contemplating that. KC: They have a vested interest in perpetuating the myth of slave labor in Egypt, but in reality, that‟s not But there‟s no question that it points out to alternative what happened. origins for the human race and the human species. And again, how can we figure out what‟s going on today if we JM: Well you know, Kerry, that‟s something that got me don‟t know where we came from, or the truth of our onto this, a long time ago before I seriously studied beginnings? And, what I was going to tell you is – this is ancient technology and ancient civilizations, was simply really fascinating – is that they are bricking up the sides the fact that we are told that the pyramids were built by of the Sphinx. Ostensibly because they said: Well, it‟s the slaves of the Egyptians who dragged these stones deteriorating and we don‟t want it to be destroyed, so through the desert, you know, without any [laughs] real we‟re going to brace it up, and we‟re going to fix it up... modern wheels or anything else, and somehow built these huge edifices. Well, who were the slaves of the Egyptians? KC: Oh, wow! The Hebrews. JM: ...and preserve it, you know. But what they‟re doing KC: Mm hm. is they‟re covering up these very... JM: Okay? And who is one of the most well documented KC: The signs of erosion... peoples in the world? The Hebrews. They had oral JM: ...the very obvious signs of vertical water erosion traditions going down for thousands of years and then which means it predates the Egyptians. finally wrote it into the books of the Old Testament of the Bible. There it all is. And I defy you to go in there and find KC: Well, what about the fact that there‟s also supposed me one verse that says: Oh, by the way, Uncle Herbie to be a library inside the Sphinx? spent his whole life dragging stones through the desert, JM: There‟s another thing. You know, Edgar Cayce – you know, to build those pyramids. back in the „30s, the great Seer – he says: Well, there‟s a It didn‟t happen! It didn‟t happen. There‟s something else room under the left paw of the Sphinx. The Army remote going on. And why don‟t they want us to know about viewers, by the way, took a look at that and they said: that? Well, over and above the fact that Egypt is totally Yeah, there‟s a room in there; and I said: What‟s in it? dependent on the tourist dollar, based on the Egyptian And they said: Jars, and vases, with scrolls, and tablets... mythos is the fact that this would tell us, possibly, of our you know. And I‟m going: Whoa! Holy Cow! The Hall of extra-terrestrial origins. And, more importantly, it would Records. We can really find out what‟s going on. You point us in the way of alternative technology and energy know? sources... KC: Absolutely. KC: Absolutely... JM: And then they used ground-penetrating radar and JM: ...and this is... they say: Yeah, we find a cavity there, under the left paw of the Sphinx. So I‟m going: Okay, great! Let‟s dig down KC: ... we‟re talking about sound technology... there and find out what it is! JM: Right. To this very day, as far as I know, nobody‟s done this; KC: ...we‟re talking about, I don‟t know, scalar waves, they won‟t allow this. They will not allow us to get to the we‟re talking about mind over matter... truth... JM: Right, exactly. KC: Yes. KC: Which is... this is all stuff in the Black Projects. JM: ...of the origins of humankind. JM: Yeah. Sonic frequencies, who knows. Have you seen KC: Exactly. the hieroglyphs of the figure standing there holding the BR: Zahi Hawass, don‟t you believe, does know what‟s big tubes? going on here? And he‟s smart enough to take account of KC: Mm hm. all these... this alternative research and remote viewing, and to try and get that information for himself. Do you JM: Okay, and there‟s a cord that runs out and behind it think there‟s something going on there behind the and goes to the little power thing, you know – they call it background? the Jedi, the tower – I call it the oscillator, okay? When I saw those, and if you go up and look real close, unlike the JM: I personally suspect that somebody has already rest of the caricatures on the hieroglyphics of figures gotten in there. I just can‟t believe that everybody knows where they just have the outline of the person cut into it‟s there and nobody'll go look to see what it is. But you the stone, this has a double outline to it. have to understand that the Egyptian authorities... who pays their salaries? KC: Hm. KC: Yeah, absolutely... JM: And we were remarking on that and wondering what does that mean, and I‟m thinking – being a cartoonist, JM: And who do they owe allegiance to? Who has trained among other things – is that when you want to show them? You know, again, we‟re back to the Evil Empire. movement, you draw extra lines. You know, if you draw a [laughs] hand, and you‟ve got some lines here, it‟s like the hand‟s KC: What about the Coral... You know the Coral Palace, moving. So, by drawing a double outline, they‟re showing or whatever they call it, down by Florida, where he Project Camelot – Jim Marrs - The Rise of the Fourth Reich in America – Feb 2009 10.