[H.A.S.C. No. 109-126] Y 4.AR 5/2 A: 2005-2006/126 Combat Vehicle Active Protectio COMBAT VEHICLE ACTIVE PROTECTION SYSTEMS HEARING BEFORE THE TACTICAL AIR AND LAND FORCES SUBCOMMITTEE OF THE COMMITTEE ON ARMED SERVICES HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES ONE HUNDRED NINTH CONGRESS SECOND SESSION HEARING HELD SEPTEMBER 21, 2006 si^iNTPK^-QP documents" ^SITORY i O8Z008 BOSTON PUBLIC LIBRARY ^^VERNMENT^O^ DEPT. U.S. GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE WASHINGTON 2007 : ForsalebytheSuperintendentofDocuments,U.S.GovernmentPrintingOffice Internet:bookstore.gpo.gov Phone;tollfree(866)512-1800;DCarea(202)512-1800 Fax:(202)512-2250 Mail:StopSSOP,Washington,DC20402-0001 [H.A.S.C. No. 109-126] Y 4.AR 5/2 A: 2005-2006/126 Combat Vehicle Active Protectio COMBAT VEHICLE ACTIVE PROTECTION SYSTEMS HEARING BEFORE THE TACTICAL AIR AND LAND FORCES SUBCOMMITTEE OF THE COMMITTEE ON ARMED SERVICES HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES ONE HUNDRED NINTH CONGRESS SECOND SESSION HEARING HELD SEPTEMBER 21, 2006 T OF DOCUMENTS 5IT0RY 1 8 Z008 .^OyERI^Nijocyi!^^ DEPT. U.S. GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE 33-593 WASHINGTON 2007 : ForsalebytheSuperintendentofDocuments,U.S.GovernmentPrintingOffice Internet;bookstore.gpo.gov Phone:tollfree(866)512-1800;DCarea(202)512-1800 Fax;(202)512-2250 Mail;StopSSOP,Washington,DC20402-0001 TACTICAL AIR AND LAND FORCES SUBCOMMITTEE CURT WELDON, Pennsylvania, Chairman HOWARD P. "BUCK" McKEON, California NEIL ABERCROMBIE, Hawaii JIM GIBBONS, Nevada IKE SKELTON, Missouri KEN CALVERT. California JOHN SPRATT, South Carolina FRANK A. LoBIONDO, New Jersey SOLOMON P. ORTIZ, Texas JEB BRADLEY, New Hampshire LANE EVANS, Illinois MICHAEL TURNER, Ohio ADAM SMITH, Washington MICHAEL CONAWAY, Texas MIKE McINTYRE, North Carohna TERRY EVERETT, Alabama ROBERT A. BRADY, Pennsylvania ROSCOE G. BARTLETT, Maryland STEVE ISRAEL, New York WALTER B. JONES, North Carolina JIM COOPER, Tennessee JIM RYUN, Kansas KENDRICK B, MEEK, Florida W. TODD AKIN, Missouri TIM RYAN, Ohio J. RANDY FORBES, Virginia G.K. BUTTERFIELD, North Carolina JOE WILSON. South Carolina DAN BOREN, Oklahoma BILL SHUSTER, Pennsylvania John Wason, Professional StaffMember Jesse Tolleson, Professional StaffMember Andrew Hunter, Professional StajffMember Benjamin Kohr, StaffAssistant (II) CONTENTS CHRONOLOGICAL LIST OF HEARINGS 2006 Page Hearing: Thursday, September 21, 2006, CombatVehicleActive Protection Systems 1 Appendix: Thursday, September 21, 2006 27 THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 21, 2006 COMBAT VEHICLE ACTIVE PROTECTION SYSTEMS STATEMENTS PRESENTED BY MEMBERS OF CONGRESS Abercrombie, Hon. Neil, a Representative from Hawaii, Ranking Member, Tactical Air and Land Forces Subcommittee 3 Weldon, Hon. Curt, a Representative from Pennsylvania, Chairman, Tactical Air and Land Forces Subcommittee 1 WITNESSES Buhrkuhl, Dr. Robert L., Director, Joint Rapid Acquisition Cell, Office of the Under Secretary ofDefense (Acquisition, Technology & Logistics) 7 Feldman, Lloyd, Assistant Director, Office of Force Transformation, Office ofthe Secretary ofDefense 10 Sorenson, Maj. Gen. Jeffrey, Deputy Assistant Secretary ofthe Army (Acqui- sition, Logistics and Technology) forAcquisition and Systems Management 9 . APPENDIX Prepared Statements: Buhrkuhl, Dr. Robert L 31 Feldman, Lloyd 48 Sorenson, Maj. Gen. Jeffrey 39 Documents Submitted for the Record: [There were no Documents submitted.] QuestionsandAnswers Submitted forthe Record: Mr. Bradley 00 Mr. Jones 00 Mr. Weldon 00 (III) COMBAT VEHICLE ACTIVE PROTECTION SYSTEMS House of Representatives, Committee on Armed Services, Tactical Air and Land Forces Subcommittee, Washington, DC, Thursday, September 21, 2006. The subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 10:02 a.m. in room 2118, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Curt Weldon (chairman ofthe subcommittee) presiding. OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. CURT WELDON, A REPRESENT- ATIVE FROM PENNSYLVANIA, CHAIRMAN, TACTICAL AIR AND LAND FORCES SUBCOMMITTEE Mr. Weldon. The subcommittee will come to order. Today con- tinuing our high priority placed on providing force protection for our men and women in combat, the subcommittee is holding its sixth hearing on force protection issues. We will receive testimony from Department ofDefense (DOD) witnesses on combat vehicle ac- tive protection systems (APS), systems designed to protect ground combat vehicles from threats like rocket propelled grenades (RPGs) and anti-tank guided missiles (ATOM). This capability has been de- scribed to me as a mini missile defense systems. Only instead of a system with 20-to—30 minute timelines, a system with 2-second to 3-second timelines and once armed is without the man-in-the- loop. Also, because of the proximity of engagements to the defending vehicle, there are associated potential collateral damage consider- ations. So achieving this capability is not without significant con- ceptual, technical, and tactical challenges. In April 2005, Central Command (CENTCOM) validated a Joint Urgent Operational Needs Statement request from our forces in Iraq for a capability that included a requirement for a fully auto- mated, active protection system against rocket propelled grenades and anti-tank missiles. Initially, the tasking for the Central Com- mand request was assigned by the Joint Rapid Acquisition Cell (JRAC) in the Office ofthe Secretary ofDefense (OSD) to the Office of Force Transformation (OFT) in the Office ofthe Secretary of De- fense. After conducting a market survey of active protective systems that offered the promise of providing near-term capability, the Of- fice of Force Transformation and other agencies to include the Army, determined that a system called TROPHY developed by an Israeli company offered the most promise of providing the required capability. After preliminary testing, the (Office of Force Trans- formation estimated that the TROPHY system could be fielded onto one demonstrator vehicle in the first halfof2007. (1) However, the Army and OSD's Joint Rapid Acquisition Cell rec- ommended against continuing testing of TROPHY because of tech- nical and collateral damage issues, and that the Central Command urgent requirement could not be met until at the earliest, the 2011 fielding of the active protection system being developed for the Army's Future Combat Systems (FCS) program. So we have a situation where Central Command has validated an urgent requirement for an active protection system. The Office of Force Transformation indicates that a system could be fielded in the first half of next year, 2007. Yet the Office of the Secretary of Defense has decided to not field a capability until 2011 at the earli- est. We would like to understand what factors went into this deci- sion. Further complicated a public understanding ofthe facts in the ef- fort to develop and field a system that could protect our personnel was a recent evening news segment. This segment implied to the mothers and fathers ofAmerica that U.S. officials are not doing ev- erything they can to give their sons and daughters the best pos- sible equipment for the war on terrorism. I don't know about our witnesses, but I know that it doesn't apply to me, and I am con- fident they believe it doesn't apply to them. The news segment in question further implied and quoted an unnamed official as saying that an active protection system is "ready today." that can be put on U.S. combat vehicles in Iraq. Well, if that is the case, I want to know where that system is. The segment also interviewed a distraught mother who had lost her son and implied that if only the Army had not blocked the TROPHY active protection system, her son would be alive today. It further went on to infer that if the Army had not blocked this system, 132 lives that were lost might not have been lost. When in actuality, the reported facts are that even if this system had been deployed in Iraq on all the vehicles for which it was designed, 122 ofthe 132 would still have been killed. Now, a loss of one serv- ice member is unacceptable and one too many. But implying that 132 would have been saved is just factually incorrect and out- rageous. This segment goes on to say that the Israeli military, based on its recent experience in Lebanon, is "rushing to deploy TROPHY." yet the best available information we have been able to get indi- cates that the Israelis had originally planned to do an operational assessment of the TROPHY system in 2007, but are now in discus- sions to attempt to accelerate this plan. We are all entitled to our own views, but I don't call this type of reporting responsible jour- nalism. This is journalism that plays on people's deep emotions, strings unrelated facts together which leads to false conclusions and with an unknown intent. Now we invited their news media, including their anchor, to come to this hearing because if they have a story to tell, let them tell it where we can ask questions as opposed to 30 or 60 second sound bites, and of course, the media which proclaims to want to have all the open information and all the facts would not send their person, even the producer, to come before this committee, which I find highly offensive. If you are going to make a claim to the American people, then have the intestinal fortitude to defend your position in front of the Members of Congress who are responsible for implementing these systems. And if you don't, in my opinion, you have no integrity as a media source. Now I will tell you what I really think when you get here in per- son. In addition, the Army has not always been clear in responding to the public and Congress and has provided contradictory informa- tion on its active protection systems program. So I am not going to be a rubber stamp for any service. In an information paper dated June 13 responding to a query from our committee, the Army stat- ed in one place that the TROPHY system could be deployed as early as the end of 2006 on Israeli vehicles, but further on in the response, indicated it was on a similar developmental timeline as the only other U.S. active protection system in development sched- uled for fielding in 2011. Similarly, explanations regarding the selection of the contractor for the Future Combat Systems active protection program are un- clear as to what the contractor was selected to do. This has led to media accusations that the Army cooked their books in the selec- tion of the contractor. We intend to ask the Government Account- ability Office (GAO) to determine the facts in the source selection. Contrary to information provided in witness statements, we are not aware of any funded program for an active protection system for M current systems like the 1 tanks, Bradley fighting vehicles or Stryker vehicles in the Army or Marine Corps budgets. We look forward to hearing the specifics of these purported pro- grams. Some of the major issues we need to address are number one, does the current threat to our combat vehicles require an ac- tive protection system for these vehicles? Number two, does an ef- fective acceptable active protection exist to equip those vehicles? And when can it be fielded? Number three, is the investment required to equip those vehicles with an active protection system warranted relative to all of our other requirements? I have additional questions about tests that the Army may or may not have attended about what the process was to determine which eventual course of action we take, and if we do have a short-term capability, why in the world aren't we im- plementing it while we pursue a longer term capability? Those are questions that this committee wants to get to the bot- tom of. Again, given the urgent action request from Central Com- mand for our forces in Iraq, the subcommittee hopes to understand why the Office of the Secretary of Defense has declined to pursue an interim active system capability. With the earliest possible pro- jected fueling ofan active system being 2011. Before we introduce the witnesses for their opening remarks, I would like to recognize my good friend from Hawaii, the ranking member, Mr. Abercrombie. STATEMENT OF HON. NEIL ABERCROMBIE, A REPRESENTA- TIVE FROM HAWAII, RANKING MEMBER, TACTICAL AIR AND LAND FORCES SUBCOMMITTEE Mr. Abercrombie. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, or- dinarily, you are aware that I seldom make a formal statement at this point and submit it for the record, but in this instance with your permission, I would Hke to speak more formally. Mr. Chairman, I believe I am correct in making the claim that there may be other committees that have as good a record as this committee does of focussing on testing and proving systems, not just in the military sense, but in any process that the Congress ap- proves oflegislatively with regard to any issue that might come be- fore us of a legitimate legislative nature, but there cannot be any committee in this Congress that pursues more assiduously the question of testing, the question of viability with regard to any ac- tivity that is legislatively mandated by us or any of those commit- tees to advance the interests ofthe American people. More particularly in this instance, where the Armed Services Committee is concerned, no committee or subcommittee pursues the issue of adequate testing in order to make certain that where the life and death of American servicemen and women is at stake, that any equipment that is provided to them has the best possible foundation. I think I can state that without reservation. To my knowledge, Mr. Chairman, certainly as far as me being your ranking member is concerned, we were not contacted. The staff associated both with my office personally and the staff as- signed by the committee certainly were never given the opportunity to inform me that such a proposal was underway by the media. Now, I don't know, Mr. Chairman, you said I see this camera over here, I don't know where it is from, but I don't see anybody named Brian Williams or Lisa Myers or any producers or anybody like that around here. I know Mr. Williams gets paid a good deal of money to pontificate daily on the air and presumably has some shred of integrity that would require him to have some kind of in- vestigation as to what he is putting forward for public consump- tion, or has some basis, in fact. Now the subject of this hearing is a critical one. How does our military select and develop weapon systems that help protect the lives of our troops in combat? Is that a fair assessment? I think so. Such a process should get the troops what they need, be open to new ideas and be willing to try unorthodox approaches. This com- mittee has been a leader in that respect. However, the process through which we give our troops equip- ment also has to be thorough. I need only cite our work on the Presidential helicopter as the most recent example. It would be tragic if an effort to protect our troops ended up instead actually putting them in greater risk, what this committee wants from the DOD and the military is a system that is both open to new ideas and timely, but also rigorous in vetting technologies before they go into battle. That is a difficult balance to strike, but finding that balance is essential. The issues in question in today's hearing are very com- plicated, both from a technical and a military operational stand- point, active protection systems "for vehi—cles are a daunting tech- nical challenge." I have an idea that that that the witnesses today are going to verify what I am saying. The systems have to be com- pletely automated due to the short reaction time available to shoot down an incoming missile or rocket-propelled grenade. I want to keep trying to read through this without getting upset about this.